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Sinclair ( comp.sys.sinclair )
 
From [email protected] Thu Oct  7 10:31:54 1993
Path: uunet!bounce-back
From: [email protected] (Arnt Gulbrandsen)
Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups,news.groups,comp.sys.misc,alt.folklore.computers
Subject: RFD: comp.sys.sinclair
Followup-To: news.groups
Date: 7 Oct 1993 09:37:28 -0400
Organization: University of Trondheim, Norway
Lines: 33
Sender: [email protected]
Approved: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: rodan.uu.net
Xref: uunet news.announce.newgroups:4131 news.groups:83814 comp.sys.misc:4902 alt.folklore.computers:53364

I posted this to news.groups on October 4th; I wasn't aware that
an RFD must be posted to news.announce.newsgroups as well as
news.groups to be valid.  Thanks to the two people who told me.
I assume the date of this posting marks the official start of the
discussion period.

Here's the RFD text:

I want to create a newsgroup, comp.sys.sinclair, to replace a
little-known mailing list which is going away soon, when its owner
loses that account.  I would prefer a newsgroup rather than a new
mailing list (which I can host) since people seem to be bad at
finding mailing lists, but good at grepping through the list of
active newsgroups.

Charter:  To provide a forum for the discussion of the various
brainchildren of Sir Clive (born Clive Sinclair) and related
computers such as the Jupiter Ace, TK95, SAM Coupe and never-to-be
Thor, software, peripherals, emulators for them, programming them;
playing those wonderful games (6031769, anyone?); and anything else
which interests the Sinclair community.  The group will not be
moderated.  If, at some future date, someone should want to make it
moderated, the same procedure should be followed as for the creation
of a new USENET group at that time.

Now, of course you all know this, but:  Sir Clive is a British
genius who's built a number of remarkable computers since the late
seventies and sold some 5-10 million of them, mostly Spectrums.
`Remarkable' is not necessarily positive... there are quite a few
remarks to be made about his cost-cutting techniques, for instance.
-- 
Arnt Gulbrandsen, [email protected]
Yes, I know, two .sigs.  No need to flame me... unless you really want to?

From [email protected] Thu Nov 11 10:21:42 1993
Path: uunet!bounce-back
From: [email protected] (Mark James)
Newsgroups: news.groups,news.announce.newgroups,alt.folklore.computers,uk.misc
Subject: CFV: comp.sys.sinclair
Followup-To: poster
Date: 10 Nov 1993 15:25:46 -0500
Organization: Usenet Volunteer Votetakers
Lines: 78
Sender: [email protected]
Approved: [email protected]
Expires: 3 Dec 1993 00:00:00 GMT
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected]
NNTP-Posting-Host: rodan.uu.net
Xref: uunet news.groups:87281 news.announce.newgroups:4251 alt.folklore.computers:55741 uk.misc:20160

                      1st CALL FOR VOTES (of 2)
 
                 Unmoderated group comp.sys.sinclair
 
Newsgroups line:
comp.sys.sinclair	Sinclair computers, eg. the ZX81, Spectrum and QL.

Votes must be received by 23:59:59 UTC, 2 December 1993.

This vote is being conducted by a neutral third party.  For voting
questions only, contact Mark James <[email protected]>.  For 
questions about the proposed group, contact Arnt Gulbrandsen 
<[email protected]>.

The Call for Votes articles will also be sent to the Sincnews mailing
list <[email protected]>, and to everyone who responded to
the RFD via email.


CHARTER
-------

To provide a forum for the discussion of the various brainchildren of
Sir Clive (born Clive Sinclair) and related computers such as the
Jupiter Ace, TK and TS series', SAM Coupe and never-to-be Thor,
software, peripherals, emulators for them, programming them; playing
those wonderful games (6031769, anyone?); and anything else which
interests the Sinclair community.  The group will not be moderated.  If,
at some future date, someone should want to make it moderated, the same
procedure should be followed as for the creation of a new USENET group
at that time. 

The newsgroup will be gatewayed to, and eventually supersede, the
Sincnews mailing list mentioned above.


STANDARD VOTING INFO
--------------------

You should send E-MAIL (posts to a group are invalid) to:

      [email protected]

(just replying by E-MAIL to this message should work, assuming your
newsreader software honors "Reply-To" headers).  Your mail message 
should contain one and only one of the following statements:

      I vote YES on comp.sys.sinclair
or
      I vote NO on comp.sys.sinclair

You may add a comment, or use other wording, but only a definite, 
unconditional, unambiguous statement for or against the creation of 
comp.sys.sinclair will count as a vote.

If you later change your mind you may vote again; only your last valid
vote will count.  You may also send in an "abstain" vote in the same 
manner, using "abstain" in place of "yes" or "no".  This will cancel
any previous vote, and will not otherwise be counted.

All votes will be acknowledged by E-mail.  If you don't receive an
acknowledgment within a few days of your vote, vote again.  A list of
any acknowledgment messages that bounce back to me is posted in the
second Call for Votes article.  (CFV articles do *not* otherwise
contain mass vote acknowledgments.)  

The complete vote list will be posted with the vote result, including
how each person voted.  Note that Usenet votes are not done by secret 
ballot.

Standard Guidelines for voting apply: no more than one vote per person,
no more than one vote per account.  The requirements for group creation
are 100 more YES votes than NO votes, and 2/3 of all votes being YES.
-- 
Mark James  <[email protected]>    *** Opinions, errors etc are mine. ***
Dialogic Corporation, 300 Littleton Road    | "Wherever people feel free to
Parsippany NJ 07054, U.S.A.                 |  smoke, I feel free to fart."
+1 201 334 1268 ext 438  Fax +1 201 334 1257|  -- J-M DuFerre, chef, 1891

From [email protected] Sat Nov 27 00:13:00 1993
Path: uunet!bounce-back
From: [email protected] (Mark James)
Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups,news.groups,alt.folklore.computers,uk.misc
Subject: 2nd CFV: comp.sys.sinclair
Supersedes: <[email protected]>
Followup-To: poster
Date: 24 Nov 1993 14:28:38 -0500
Organization: Usenet Volunteer Votetakers
Lines: 85
Sender: [email protected]
Approved: [email protected]
Expires: 3 Dec 1993 00:00:00 GMT
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: rodan.uu.net
Xref: uunet news.announce.newgroups:4319 news.groups:88625 alt.folklore.computers:56818 uk.misc:20943

                      2nd CALL FOR VOTES (of 2)
 
                 Unmoderated group comp.sys.sinclair
 
Newsgroups line:
comp.sys.sinclair	Sinclair computers, eg. the ZX81, Spectrum and QL.

Votes must be received by 23:59:59 UTC, 2 December 1993.

This vote is being conducted by a neutral third party.  For voting
questions only, contact Mark James <[email protected]>.  For 
questions about the proposed group, contact Arnt Gulbrandsen 
<[email protected]>.

The Call for Votes articles will also be sent to the Sincnews mailing
list <[email protected]>, and to everyone who responded to
the RFD via email.


CHARTER
-------

To provide a forum for the discussion of the various brainchildren of
Sir Clive (born Clive Sinclair) and related computers such as the
Jupiter Ace, TK and TS series', SAM Coupe and never-to-be Thor,
software, peripherals, emulators for them, programming them; playing
those wonderful games (6031769, anyone?); and anything else which
interests the Sinclair community.  The group will not be moderated.  If,
at some future date, someone should want to make it moderated, the same
procedure should be followed as for the creation of a new USENET group
at that time. 

The newsgroup will be gatewayed to, and eventually supersede, the
Sincnews mailing list mentioned above.


STANDARD VOTING INFO
--------------------

You should send E-MAIL (posts to a group are invalid) to:

      [email protected]

(just replying by E-MAIL to this message should work, assuming your
newsreader software honors "Reply-To" headers).  Your mail message 
should contain one and only one of the following statements:

      I vote YES on comp.sys.sinclair
or
      I vote NO on comp.sys.sinclair

You may add a comment, or use other wording, but only a definite, 
unconditional, unambiguous statement for or against the creation of 
comp.sys.sinclair will count as a vote.

If you later change your mind you may vote again; only your last valid
vote will count.  You may also send in an "abstain" vote in the same 
manner, using "abstain" in place of "yes" or "no".  This will cancel
any previous vote, and will not otherwise be counted.

All votes will be acknowledged by E-mail.  If you don't receive an
acknowledgment within a few days of your vote, vote again.  A list of
any acknowledgment messages that bounce back to me is posted in the
second Call for Votes article.  (CFV articles do *not* otherwise
contain mass vote acknowledgments.)  

The complete vote list will be posted with the vote result, including
how each person voted.  Note that Usenet votes are not done by secret 
ballot.

Standard Guidelines for voting apply: no more than one vote per person,
no more than one vote per account.  The requirements for group creation
are 100 more YES votes than NO votes, and 2/3 of all votes being YES.


BOUNCED VOTE ACKNOWLEDGMENTS
----------------------------

No vote acknowledgments have bounced. 

-- 
Mark James  <[email protected]>    *** Opinions, errors etc are mine. ***
Dialogic Corporation, 300 Littleton Road    | "Wherever people feel free to
Parsippany NJ 07054, U.S.A.                 |  smoke, I feel free to fart."
+1 201 334 1268 ext 438  Fax +1 201 334 1257|  -- J-M DuFerre, chef, 1891

From [email protected] Tue Dec  7 18:07:13 1993
Path: uunet!bounce-back
From: [email protected] (Mark James)
Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups,news.groups,alt.folklore.computers,uk.misc
Subject: RESULT: comp.sys.sinclair passes 318:27
Supersedes: <[email protected]>
Followup-To: news.groups
Date: 7 Dec 1993 15:52:35 -0500
Organization: Usenet Volunteer Votetakers
Lines: 404
Sender: [email protected]
Approved: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: rodan.uu.net
Xref: uunet news.announce.newgroups:4376 news.groups:89561 alt.folklore.computers:57736 uk.misc:21458

                               VOTE RESULT

                   Unmoderated group comp.sys.sinclair

Voting closed on 2 December 1993 at 23:59:59 GMT.  The results are:

Yes votes:  318
No votes:    27

This margin is adequate for newgroup creation.  There will now be a
five-day period during which corrections to the vote count may be
made.  Barring massive controversy about the vote, the group will 
be created at the end of this period.

This vote was conducted by a neutral third party.  

Vote-taker: 		Mark James <[email protected]>
Group proponent: 	Arnt Gulbrandsen <[email protected]>

Newsgroups line:
comp.sys.sinclair	Sinclair computers, eg. the ZX81, Spectrum and QL.


CHARTER (as printed in the Call for Votes)
-------

To provide a forum for the discussion of the various brainchildren of
Sir Clive (born Clive Sinclair) and related computers such as the
Jupiter Ace, TK and TS series', SAM Coupe and never-to-be Thor,
software, peripherals, emulators for them, programming them; playing
those wonderful games (6031769, anyone?); and anything else which
interests the Sinclair community.  The group will not be moderated.  If,
at some future date, someone should want to make it moderated, the same
procedure should be followed as for the creation of a new USENET group
at that time. 

The newsgroup will be gatewayed to, and eventually supersede, the
Sincnews mailing list.


VOTE ACKNOWLEDGMENT
-------------------

These lists are sorted in alphabetical order by login name, as taken
>from the "From:" line.  Note that certain UUCP addresses are mangled 
somewhat in order to sort nicely.


YES votes were received from the following people:

[email protected] (Chris FOWLER)
[email protected] (Graham Underwood)
[email protected] (Steve Adams)
[email protected] (Dermot Mc Nally)
[email protected] 
[email protected] (A G Jackson)
[email protected] (Andrew Jessett) 
[email protected] 
[email protected] (L.Miguel Carmona)
[email protected] (Ramesh Fernando) 
[email protected] (Aaron Priven) 
[email protected] (Adam David) 
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Arnt Gulbrandsen)
[email protected] (Wout van Albada) 
[email protected] (Andras Salamon) 
[email protected] (Andreas Heimdal) 
[email protected] (Andrew Williams)
[email protected] (Andy Holyer) 
[email protected] (Andrew Hird)
[email protected] (Andy Norman)
[email protected] (Andries Dippenaar) 
[email protected] (Andrew Jerrison)
[email protected] (Dale T. Long)
[email protected] (Arve Stavo)
[email protected] (Michael Damian Audley)
[email protected] (Jon Massey)
[email protected] (Roger Backhouse [Economics])
[email protected] (John Nettleton) 
[email protected] (Bartosz Blacha)
[email protected] (Bernhard Scheffold) 
[email protected] (Bernd Finger) 
[email protected] (B.J. Herbison)
[email protected] (Barry McConnell) 
[email protected] (Brendan McKeon) 
[email protected] (Borge Noest) 
[email protected] (Drinks All The Water) 
[email protected] (Rune Bremnes)
[email protected] (C.J.COULSON)
[email protected] (Calum Benson) 
[email protected] 
[email protected] 
[email protected] (R.K.Thomson)
[email protected] (ccaakrt)
[email protected] (Carlos Garcia Garcia) 
[email protected] (Christer Hasse Leth Nielsen)
[email protected] (Chua Hak Lien)
[email protected] (MX::CHUBRIK_M)
[email protected] (Martin Chudley) 
[email protected] (Mikael Bj|rn)
[email protected] (Peter Cooper)
[email protected] (Kip Crosby) 
[email protected] (Matthew Crosby)
[email protected] (Simon Cooke)
[email protected] (Mr N J Kettlewell)
[email protected] (W Towle)
[email protected] (J M Hicks)
[email protected] 
[email protected] 
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Fredrik Ekman)
[email protected] (David Graham)
[email protected] (David Hembrow) 
[email protected] (David Smith) 
[email protected] (Mr. P.R.D Day) 
[email protected] (Derek Bell)
[email protected] (David Boothroyd) 
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Donal Cunningham)
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Dean Dierschow) 
[email protected] (John DiFelici) 
[email protected] (Dan Landry) 
[email protected] (Dimitris Margaritis) 
[email protected] (Dan Murphy) 
[email protected]@mfltd.co.uk 
[email protected] (DoN. Nichols) 
[email protected] (Danny Halamish)
[email protected] (Heikki Julkunen - HFB T dp93) 
[email protected] (Rebecca Drayer) 
[email protected] (David Thomas Richard Given)
[email protected] (Jerry Dunham) 
[email protected] (David A. Watola) 
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Rickard Jutegaard) 
[email protected] (Matthew D Wilson)
[email protected] (Malcolm MacArthur)
[email protected] (Mike Knell) 
[email protected] (James Williams) 
[email protected] (Eric Pass) 
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Eric Gustafson) 
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Espen Iveland)
[email protected] (Alan F. Perry) 
[email protected] (Peter Kaerde)
[email protected] (Marat Fayzullin)
[email protected] (Gregory C Franklin ) 
[email protected] (Bruce Clement) 
[email protected] (Frode Teigen)
[email protected] (Frode Tennebo) 
[email protected] (Finnbogi R. Ragnarsson) 
[email protected] (Brad Meier) 
[email protected] (Gabriel Fried f1)
[email protected] (Gard Abrahamsen)
[email protected] (Andrew Gaylard) 
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Geir Atle Storhaug)
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Tor Gjerde) 
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Gareth J Poxon PML)
[email protected] (Gabe M Wiener)
[email protected] (Gilad Raz)
[email protected] (Claus Graf) 
[email protected] (David Iain Greig) 
[email protected] (Henk de Groot) 
[email protected] (Richard Hable) 
[email protected] (Holger Lubitz) 
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Michael Hauben)
[email protected] (Steve Burge)
[email protected] (Heiko Sawade (Praktikant Werling))
[email protected] (Herbert Ruessink)
[email protected] (Herbert L Schaaf)
[email protected] (Ben Hodson)
[email protected] (H. Peter Anvin N9ITP) 
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Gerzson Szinyei) 
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Hanno Foest) 
[email protected] (IOANNIS SAVVIDIS)
ISIMMOND%[email protected] (Ian Simmonds ECD)
[email protected] (Ismael Cordeiro) 
[email protected] (Ian Jackson) 
[email protected] (James Smith)
[email protected] (Kees van der Wal)
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Jamie Jones)
[email protected] (Jean Austermuehle) 
[email protected] (Jens Kilian)
[email protected] (Jeremy Fitzhardinge) 
[email protected] (Jesus Folgueira) 
[email protected] (John Grogan) 
[email protected] (Joe Hartley) 
[email protected] (Jamie A Lawson)
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Daniel Barlow)
[email protected] (john derbyshire) 
[email protected] (John West)
[email protected] (John Stonier)
[email protected] (Martin Kullberg)
[email protected] (Klaus Breuer (CIP 91))
[email protected] (ROBERT KAMINSKY)
[email protected] (Kevan Heydon)
[email protected] (Kim Kortermand Hansen)
[email protected] (Eric J. Korpela)
[email protected] (Laurence Abbott)
[email protected] (Jardar Leira) 
[email protected] (Leif Hedstrom)
[email protected] (Leif Kornstaedt) 
[email protected] (S. Marshall) 
[email protected] (Martin R.J. Cleaver)
[email protected] (Richard Carlsson) 
[email protected] (+-)
[email protected] (Anders (Majland) Pedersen ) 
[email protected] (Makis A. Maroulis) 
marcosm%[email protected] (Marcos Francisco Ferreira de Macedo) 
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Moral Leadership & Personal Availability)
[email protected] (Martin Thomas) 
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Bob Tinsley)
[email protected] 
mccrackn%[email protected] (Andrew R McCracken)
[email protected] (Mark Rogers)
[email protected] (Satan wants to DO YOU at DIT!! (DIT is an equa)
[email protected] (Francesco Zanichelli) 
[email protected] (Mike Borcherds)
[email protected] (Mikael Bonnier)
[email protected] (Mike Rogers)
[email protected] (Mike Currin) 
[email protected] (H. Milton Johnson) 
[email protected] (Stefano Mora) 
[email protected] (Moss A D)
[email protected] 
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Mark Crawford)
[email protected] (Rene Scholz) 
[email protected] (Martin Schroder) 
[email protected] (Manuel Sales) 
[email protected] (msmith)
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Maciek Uhlig)
[email protected]!wybbs (Mike Burden)
[email protected] (Neil L Cook)
[email protected] (Randy Finder)
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Mad_Mas!)
[email protected] (Nat Pryce)
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Steen Kruse)
[email protected] (TI1 Christof Odenthal) 
[email protected] (Konstantin Olchanski) 
[email protected] (Oliver Fink) 
[email protected] (PJ CASTLEDINE)
[email protected] (Allan Hamill)
[email protected] (Paul Olsen)
[email protected] (Bret Hoeffler)
[email protected] (Piers Cawley)
[email protected] (Mario E Miniaci)
[email protected] (John 'Pelago' Veness)
[email protected] (Pete French)
[email protected] (Peter A. Broadbery) 
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Peter McGavin)
[email protected] (Thomas Petersen) 
[email protected] (Peter Sulzer) 
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Phillip Lougher)
[email protected] (Pieter Immelman)
[email protected] (Paul Janzen)
[email protected] (PJ Eaton)
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Petteri Pajunen)
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Michael J. Quinn)
[email protected] 
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Richard Zidlicky (CIP 90))
[email protected] (Toby Rees)
[email protected] (Anne-Marie Reidy)
[email protected] (Raul Garcia Garcia) 
[email protected] (Richard H. Miller) 
[email protected] (Roberto Jesus Garcia Garcia) 
[email protected] (Richard Kettlewell)
[email protected] (Renato Jansen de Oliveira Figueiredo) 
[email protected] (Richard L. Jones) 
[email protected] (Rob Logan) 
[email protected] (John Robinson)
[email protected] (RH Schone)
[email protected] (Roderick Begbie) 
[email protected] (Rodolfo Rojo (Filosofia)) 
[email protected] (Robert H. Klein)
[email protected] (David E. Fox) 
[email protected] (Ross)
[email protected] (Ruben Martinez)
[email protected] 
[email protected] (S.M. Hanson)
[email protected] (MEUNIER Fredrick) 
[email protected] (Ole Andre Schistad) 
[email protected] (Sean Molloy)
[email protected] (Martin Davies)
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Teresa Simms)
[email protected] (Simon Wallis)
[email protected] (S J Drew)
[email protected] (Georgios Germanos)
[email protected] 
[email protected] 
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Scott Telford)
[email protected] (Dirk Steinkopf - DStk)
[email protected] (Jorma A Stenman)
[email protected] (Stephen Usher)
[email protected] (Steve M Lake)
[email protected] (Stig Hemmer)
[email protected] (Stefan T Schwingeler) 
Stuart Foster [email protected]
[email protected] (Stuart Boutell) 
[email protected] (Sven Wachter) 
[email protected] (Sander van Malssen) 
[email protected] (TIMOTHY C. SWENSON) 
[email protected] (Sascha Wildner)
[email protected] (Hanson Benjamin) 
[email protected] (Stephan Schulz)
[email protected] (William Burrow)
[email protected] (Tim Ramsey) 
[email protected] (Thomas Beagle)
[email protected] (Tero J Jyrinki)
[email protected] (Thomas McWilliams) 
[email protected] (Tad Morgan) 
[email protected]vision.com (TOM) 
[email protected] (Thomas James Jones)
[email protected] (Toni Cortes Rossello) 
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Tor Iver Wilhelmsen)
[email protected] (Tony P J Stilling)
[email protected] (R Daniel Stock)
[email protected] (Richard Forster)
[email protected] (Christopher Owen)
[email protected] (Tom Randulff)
[email protected] (James Rigg)
[email protected] (Su-Ming Tan)
[email protected] (Martin M|ller Pedersen)
[email protected] (J Hoar)
[email protected] 
[email protected] 
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Ury Segal)
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Antonio Vasconcelos)
[email protected] (Jorge)
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Walter Friedrich) 
[email protected] (the stupid one)
[email protected] (Sean Michael Wetterer)
wilson%[email protected] (Wilson Roberto Afonso) 
[email protected] (Ramco v.d. Woestijne) 
[email protected] (Marek Janous)
[email protected] (Jerabek David (NH))
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Dave Yadallee) 
[email protected] 
[email protected] (gender is as gender does)
[email protected] (Yuval Yarom)
[email protected] (Zigmunds Vainers)
[email protected] (Zoltan Kocsi) 


NO votes were received from the following people:

[email protected] 
[email protected] (Bob Weissman) 
[email protected] (Niels Olof Bouvin)
[email protected] (Christopher Trown) 
[email protected] (David Cameron) 
[email protected] (Edward Bertsch) 
[email protected] (Paul Eggert) 
[email protected] (Eliot Shepard)
[email protected] (Ed Taychert) 
[email protected] (Frank I. Reiter) 
[email protected] (Sean P Ryan)
[email protected] (John De Armond) 
[email protected] (John Fax This! MacWilliamson) 
[email protected] (Julian Macassey) 
[email protected] (Lonadar the Wanderer) 
[email protected] (Maxime Taksar KC6ZPS)
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Paul Foley)
[email protected] (Paul Martin Barry) 
[email protected] (Andy Cross) 
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Sendhil Revuluri)
[email protected] (Walter Roberson) 
[email protected] 
[email protected] (Shane Hartman)
[email protected] (Steve Rogers) 
[email protected] (Timo Rinne)
-- 
Mark James  <[email protected]>    *** Opinions, errors etc are mine. ***
Dialogic Corporation, 300 Littleton Road    | "Wherever people feel free to
Parsippany NJ 07054, U.S.A.                 |  smoke, I feel free to fart."
+1 201 334 1268 ext 438  Fax +1 201 334 1257|  -- J-M DuFerre, chef, 1891

 
USENET FACT: Flaming
Flaming is the hostile interaction between multiple Usenet users.