From [email protected] Mon Sep 27 10:38:57 1993 Flags: 000000000201 Path: lear From: [email protected] (Denbigh Starkey) Date: Mon, 11 Feb 91 10:51:01 PST X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.1.2 7/11/90) Subject: CALL FOR DISCUSSION: misc.grad-schools Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups Followup-to: news.groups Keywords: posted Proposed new group: misc.grad-schools Charter: I propose the establishment of a news group restricted to the dissemination of information about graduate programs. Currently there are a number of relatively expensive (and often ineffective) ways for graduate schools to distribute information including fliers, Peterson's Guides, professional society student directories, etc. The proposed new group would provide an additional, simple place for students who are looking for graduate school information. In addition, for many international students it would become the best way for obtaining information about universities in other countries. I suggest that this should be an unmoderated group, but with a set of rules that are posted each month. These rules would be designed to keep the group as effective as possible as a source of information for prospective graduate students. I suggest that there be three conventions or rules: 1. Standard Subject line, listing the degree area and the university. e.g. Subject: Computer Science, Montana State University 2. Standard format in the body of the proposal. Information to be filled in should include: (a) Name, e-address, phone, and snail-address for a contact point. (b) Faculty names, degrees, interests, and e-addresses. (c) Facilities available for graduate students. (d) Availability of financial support. (e) Degrees offered. (f) Specific requirements. (e.g., GRE, TOEFL, TSE, etc.) (g) Deadline for applications. (h) Description of the university and location (150 words max?). 3. Restrictions on how often each department can post a description to the group. I suggest that it be restricted to at most once a month. Initially, I would expect that there would be more Computer Science activity than for all other disciplines combined. However, I hope that this would quickly change. As a result, I propose using the misc hierarchy, and naming the group misc.grad-schools. This is a first CFD for the proposed new group. I have cross-posted to some of the larger overseas soc.culture groups, since their readers are likely to benefit from the proposal, but following the normal USENET guidelines for group creation, all followups are directed to news.groups, where discussion should take place. Denbigh S. [email protected], [email protected] 406-994-4780 (work), 406-586-7614 (home) From [email protected] Mon Sep 27 10:45:38 1993 Xref: rpi news.announce.newgroups:879 soc.college:5106 misc.education:1466 comp.edu:2612 Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups,soc.college,misc.education,comp.edu Path: rpi!tale From: [email protected] (Denbigh Starkey) Subject: CFD: soc.college.grad[.d] (misc.grad-schools) Followup-To: news.groups Sender: [email protected] Nntp-Posting-Host: cs.rpi.edu Date: 18 Feb 91 06:53:15 GMT Approved: [email protected] Lines: 96 Proposed new groups: soc.college.grad soc.college.grad.d Replaces proposal for misc.grad-schools Summary of the proposed new groups: soc.college.grad To be used exclusively for periodic announcements, in standard form, describing graduate programs. soc.college.grad.d To be used for discussions about graduate schools. On January 29, 1991, I posted a CFD for a new group, and proposed that it be named misc.grad-schools. The basic concept received strong support, except for disagreements about the proposed name, about whether graduate school discussions should be included, and about whether or not it should be moderated. I'll cover my views on these in the next three paragraphs. Nobody made any criticisms of the basic concept or of the specific information that should be included in the standard informational postings. Group name: There were a wide variety of comments about the hierarchy and name that I selected, best summarized by Greg Kuperberg who said: >It's a good idea but a bad name. soc.grad-schools would be a better name, >and soc.college.grad would be better still. "misc" is a curse to the net. Alternative hierarchies proposed by Greg and others were based on the existing soc.college and misc.education hierarchies. Since soc.college is read by an estimated 35,000 USENET readers, as compared to 14,000 for misc.education, and is also received by 5% more sites (82% vs. 77%), I selected the soc.college hierarchy for continued discussion. Two groups: I now propose two new groups, soc.college.grad and soc.college.grad.d, with soc.college.grad restricted to departmental ads in specified format, and soc.college.grad.d for unrestricted discussions of graduate schools. This decision seems to match the majority of the comments that have been made. Moderated or unmoderated: All people making comments have agreed that the discussion group should be unmoderated. There is disagreement on whether or not the main group should be moderated. My personal opinion is that groups should only be moderated if the lack of moderation causes problems. I suggest that soc.college.grad be unmoderated, but with a monthly READ THIS BEFORE YOU POST posting which explains the differences between the two groups, and the guidelines for posting to soc.college.grad. I volunteer to post the monthly posting, and also to be responsible for sending out polite e-mail reminders when users badly abuse the guidelines or policy. If significant problems arise, then I suggest that we should reconsider moderation at that time. Moderated groups have problems with moderators taking vacations, getting busy, etc., and I hope that we would be able to control the group without this extra bureaucracy. Moderated groups also cause problems for a number of news posting systems particularly if cross-posting is attempted. To remove some potential problems with follow-ups, I've added a rule into the soc.college.grad charter that followups must be directed to soc.college.grad.d. Charter for soc.college.grad: This news group will be restricted to the dissemination of information about graduate programs. Currently there are a number of relatively expensive (and often ineffective) ways for graduate schools to distribute information including fliers, Peterson's Guides, professional society student directories, etc. The proposed new group would provide an additional, simple place for students who are looking for graduate school information. In addition, for many international students it would become the best way for obtaining information about universities in other countries. This will be an unmoderated group, but with a set of rules that are posted each month. These rules would be designed to keep the group as effective as possible as an official source of information for prospective graduate students. There will be four conventions or rules: 1. Standard Subject line, listing the degree area and the university. e.g. Subject: Computer Science, Montana State University 2. Standard format in the body of the proposal. Information to be filled in should include: (a) Name, e-address, phone, and snail-address for a contact point. (b) Faculty names, degrees, interests, and e-addresses. (c) Facilities available for graduate students. (d) Availability of financial support. (e) Degrees offered. (f) Specific requirements. (e.g., GRE, TOEFL, TSE, etc.) (g) Deadline for applications. (h) Description of the university and location (150 words max). 3. No department will be able to post more than once each month. 4. All postings must specify a followup field of soc.college.grad.d Charter for soc.college.grad: An unmoderated group for the discussion of graduate school issues. Will also act as the followup group for discussions initiated by announcements in the misc.college.grad group. This is a revised CFD for the proposed new groups. In addition to soc.college, misc.education, and other similar groups, I have cross-posted to some of the larger overseas soc.culture groups since their readers are likely to benefit from the proposal, but following the normal USENET guidelines for group creation, all followups are directed to news.groups, where discussion should take place. Denbigh S. [email protected], [email protected] 406-994-4780 (work), 406-586-7614 (home) From [email protected] Wed Apr 5 19:17:46 1995 Xref: rpi news.announce.newgroups:946 news.groups:22983 soc.college:5366 Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups,news.groups,soc.college Path: rpi!tale From: [email protected] (Brian Yamauchi) Subject: RFD: soc.college.grad Followup-To: news.groups Sender: [email protected] Nntp-Posting-Host: cs.rpi.edu Date: 14 Mar 91 04:01:28 GMT Approved: [email protected] Lines: 28 Group Name: soc.college.grad Group Type: Unmoderated Group Charter: soc.college.grad would be an unmoderated newsgroup for general discussion of issues related to graduate school and graduate student life. Such subjects could include theses, research fields, advisors, committees, funding sources, research careers, teaching careers, the academic/research/social environment of different departments, and any other topic relating to any aspect of graduate life. These issues are sufficiently different from those concerning undergraduate college students that a separate newsgroup would be a useful addition to the soc.college.* hierarchy. Most undergrads aren't concerned with creating a thesis committee and most grad students aren't concerned with joining a fraternity or sorority. Note that this is separate and disjoint from the current CFV for soc.college.gradinfo, a group limited to official postings of graduate program descriptions. (A similar group was proposed in the original CFD, but was dropped from the final CFV.) However, discussion of program descriptions posted to soc.college.gradinfo could take place in soc.college.grad (e.g. "This is what the PR office says -- what's the truth?"). -- Brian Yamauchi University of Rochester [email protected] Department of Computer Science From [email protected] Mon Sep 11 16:15:50 1995 Xref: rpi news.announce.newgroups:1059 news.groups:24997 soc.college:5736 soc.college.gradinfo:140 Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups,news.groups,soc.college,soc.college.gradinfo Path: rpi!bounce-back From: [email protected] (Brian Yamauchi) Subject: CFV: soc.college.grad Followup-To: poster Sender: [email protected] Nntp-Posting-Host: cs.rpi.edu Date: 19 Apr 91 05:34:19 GMT Approved: [email protected] Lines: 52 Status: RO X-Status: Group Name: soc.college.grad Group Type: Unmoderated Group Charter: soc.college.grad would be an unmoderated newsgroup for general discussion of issues related to graduate schools (including professional schools -- i.e. law, medicine, business) and graduate student life. Such subjects could include theses, research fields, advisors, committees, funding sources, research careers, teaching careers, the academic/research/social environment of different departments, and any other topic relating to any aspect of graduate life. These issues are sufficiently different from those concerning undergraduate college students that a separate newsgroup would be a useful addition to the soc.college.* hierarchy. Most undergrads aren't concerned with creating a thesis committee and most grad students aren't concerned with joining a fraternity or sorority. Note that this is separate and disjoint from soc.college.gradinfo, which is dedicated to graduate program descriptions. However, discussion of program descriptions posted to soc.college.gradinfo could take place in soc.college.grad (e.g. "This is what the PR office says -- what's the truth?"). [Apologies for crossposting this CFV in soc.college.gradinfo, but I felt it would be useful for those currently discussing grad-related subjects in that newsgroup.] Votes should be mailed to: [email protected] Votes should include in the SUBJECT HEADER either: soc.college.grad: YES or soc.college.grad: NO In general, the text of vote messages may not be read, so if you have any additional comments or questions, please send these in a separate message. The voting starts immediately and ends at 23:59 UT on 9 May 1991. Only votes mailed (not posted) in this interval will be counted. A number of people have mailed positive comments about the group and one person mailed a negative comment. These are not considered votes. -- Brian Yamauchi University of Rochester [email protected] Department of Computer Science From [email protected] Mon Sep 11 16:16:14 1995 Xref: rpi news.announce.newgroups:1078 news.groups:25358 soc.college:5930 soc.college.gradinfo:249 Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups,news.groups,soc.college,soc.college.gradinfo Path: rpi!bounce-back From: [email protected] (Brian Yamauchi) Subject: 2nd CFV and VOTE ACK: soc.college.grad Followup-To: poster Sender: [email protected] Nntp-Posting-Host: cs.rpi.edu Date: 26 Apr 91 05:02:31 GMT Approved: [email protected] Lines: 169 Status: RO X-Status: Group Name: soc.college.grad Group Type: Unmoderated Group Charter: soc.college.grad would be an unmoderated newsgroup for general discussion of issues related to graduate schools (including professional schools -- i.e. law, medicine, business) and graduate student life. Such subjects could include theses, research fields, advisors, committees, funding sources, research careers, teaching careers, the academic/research/social environment of different departments, and any other topic relating to any aspect of graduate life. These issues are sufficiently different from those concerning undergraduate college students that a separate newsgroup would be a useful addition to the soc.college.* hierarchy. Most undergrads aren't concerned with creating a thesis committee and most grad students aren't concerned with joining a fraternity or sorority. Note that this is separate and disjoint from soc.college.gradinfo, which is dedicated to graduate program descriptions. However, discussion of program descriptions posted to soc.college.gradinfo could take place in soc.college.grad (e.g. "This is what the PR office says -- what's the truth?"). [Apologies for crossposting this CFV in soc.college.gradinfo, but I felt it would be useful for those currently discussing grad-related subjects in that newsgroup.] Votes should be mailed to: [email protected] Votes should include in the SUBJECT HEADER either: soc.college.grad: YES or soc.college.grad: NO In general, the text of vote messages may not be read, so if you have any additional comments or questions, please send these in a separate message. Votes must be sent by mail -- posted votes will not be counted. The voting ends at 23:59 UT on May 9. Votes received after this date will not be counted. In order for soc.college.grad to be created, 2/3 of the received votes must be yes votes, and there must be 100 more yes votes than no votes. The 112 votes received as of 23:30 EDT on April 25 are listed below: """(Marc Riese)" "Anthony M. Petro, Office of Information Systems" "Barbara J. Kratz" "Mark A. Lindsay" "PAMELA L. SCHAFER" "ROGER GREEN,MEDICINE,ST.JOHN'S,NF,CAN" "john watts" "[email protected] (Systems Research Supervisor)" "sendhil revuluri" Ann Shilling Brendan Mumey Chris Pounds Curt Schroeder [email protected] Dan Christensen Dan Wallach David Chalmers David G. Paschich Delia Cioffi Dominic Duggan Dwight Spencer Germaine L'Eveque Harald Nordg}rd-Hansen Jason Howard Elbaum John A December Kate Gregory Kevin Denelsbeck Koen Versmissen Liz Johnson Mark J. McIntosh Mark M Mehl Michael M. Marx / Jerusalem - Israel. Milt Epstein Peter Montgomery Prabal K. Acharyya Richard H. Miller Sean Philip Engelson Sigfred H}versen Kilberg THE MAD ONDATRA Teresa C D Carstensen Yoram Eisenstadter [email protected] (Adwait B Sathye) [email protected] (Satyen G Baindur) [email protected] (Catherine Middleton) [email protected] (Cary Timar) [email protected] (Carl Rigney) [email protected] (Frank Chance) [email protected] (Cyndi Norman) [email protected] (Robert Scott Colello) [email protected] (Curt Burgess) [email protected] [email protected] (Paulo da Costa 42147) [email protected] (Daniel Jacobson) [email protected] (Dave Phillips) [email protected] (David Robinson) [email protected] (Dan Briggs) [email protected] (David C. Tuttle) [email protected] (David Elliston) [email protected] (Tom Fitzgerald) [email protected] (Davis W. Frank) [email protected] (Luis Giron) [email protected] [email protected] (Lee Bennett) [email protected] (Guy A. Schiavone) harvard!ames!amdcad!netcom.com!nagar ( Nagar) harvard!ames!juts.ccc.amdahl.com!ked01 (Kim DeVaughn) harvard!ames!shakespeare.ras.amdahl.com!lynn (Lynn Robinson) harvard!ames!zorch.SF-Bay.ORG!xanthian (Kent Paul Dolan) harvard!genrad.com!rob (Robert S. Wood) [email protected] (Denbigh Starkey) [email protected] [email protected] (Jin Kim) kEvin [email protected] (Brian Kenney) [email protected] (Rob Knauerhase) [email protected] [email protected] (Audrey C Mack) [email protected] (Mark Sicignano) [email protected] (M. P. Gerlek) [email protected] (Craig Groeschel) [email protected] (Robert F Solon) [email protected] (Norwitz Neal) [email protected] (Olaf von Bremen) [email protected] (Oktay S. Ahiska) [email protected] (Leonard Peirce) [email protected] (Michal Prussak) [email protected] [email protected] (Mahesh Amarlal Rajani) [email protected] (Raymond Yee) richard wyckoff [email protected] (Rudi Halbright) rutgers!mtxinu.com!jrb (John Black) rutgers!ncratl.atlantaga.ncr.com!alewis [email protected] (Meta Sienkiewicz) [email protected] (Richard Sikorski, MAC RSMAS Umiami 305-361-4714) [email protected] (Chris Spell) [email protected] (Ken Staggers) [email protected] [email protected] (Timothy W. Lynch) [email protected] (Thomas Skibo) [email protected] (Tom Frauenhofer) [email protected] (Tellier Philippe) [email protected] (Upasana) [email protected] (David Wald) [email protected] (Carol Wang) [email protected] [email protected] (Ajay Khanna) [email protected] (Chris * 249-4092 22-Apr-1991 2216) [email protected] [email protected] (yoshio nakamura) [email protected] (Zoran Kacic-Alesic) -- Brian Yamauchi University of Rochester [email protected] Department of Computer Science From [email protected] Mon Sep 11 16:17:28 1995 Xref: rpi news.announce.newgroups:1129 news.groups:25940 soc.college:6195 soc.college.gradinfo:372 Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups,news.groups,soc.college,soc.college.gradinfo Path: rpi!bounce-back From: [email protected] (Brian Yamauchi) Subject: RESULT: soc.college.grad passes 155: 22 Followup-To: news.groups Sender: [email protected] Nntp-Posting-Host: cs.rpi.edu Date: 13 May 91 05:17:37 GMT Approved: [email protected] Lines: 203 Status: O X-Status: The vote for soc.college.grad has been completed, and the proposal to create the group has passed. YES votes: 155 NO votes: 22 YES votes - NO votes: 133 > 100 YES votes / NO votes: 7.05 > 2.00 Since there are 100 more YES votes than NO votes and twice as many YES votes as NO votes, the group meets both of the criteria necessary to pass. After a waiting period has passed to resolve any questions about the vote, a newgroup will be issued for soc.college.grad. The following is a list of all votes received: YES votes: "" " SHERIDAN K. HOUGHTEN " "(Marc Riese)" "Anthony M. Petro, Office of Information Systems" "Barbara J. Kratz" "D.J." Crawford "Dean Hougen" "Donna M. Whittingham" "Hector Ruben Cordero-Guzman" "Mark A. Lindsay" "PAMELA L. SCHAFER" "ROGER GREEN,MEDICINE,ST.JOHN'S,NF,CAN" "john watts" "michael shalom kochin" "[email protected] (Systems Research Supervisor)" "sendhil revuluri" AL-NABEGHA AL-DHEBYANI ASSASSINS R US Ann Shilling Arthur Tateishi Brendan Mumey Carolyn Philippe Chris Pounds Curt Schroeder [email protected] Dan Christensen Dan Wallach Daniel Fu David Chalmers David G. Paschich David J. Murphy Delia Cioffi Dominic Duggan Dwight Spencer Germaine L'Eveque [email protected] Isabelle Laye Jason Howard Elbaum Joe Hughes John A December Jorge Rufat 283-4308 Josh Hayes Karen Ward Kate Gregory Kevin Denelsbeck Koen Versmissen Liz Johnson Mark J. McIntosh Michael Cummings Milt Epstein Norman Danner Peter H. Hellmonds Peter Montgomery Prabal K. Acharyya Prasanna Malaviya Robert Craig Harman Sally Roberts Sean Philip Engelson Sigfred H}versen Kilberg Steve Reeves THE MAD ONDATRA Teresa C D Carstensen [email protected] Yoram Eisenstadter Yun Yau Shih [email protected] (Adwait B Sathye) atmadja%[email protected] [email protected] [email protected] (Satyen G Baindur) [email protected] (Thomas L. Bodine) [email protected] (Catherine Middleton) [email protected] (Cary Timar) [email protected] (Antonella Ceroni) [email protected] (Frank Chance) [email protected] (Cyndi Norman) [email protected] (Robert Scott Colello) [email protected] (Rodrigo Vanegas) [email protected] (Terry Rawlings) [email protected] (Curt Burgess) [email protected] [email protected] (Daniel Jacobson) [email protected] (Dave Phillips) [email protected] (Dan Briggs) [email protected] (David C. Tuttle) [email protected] (Bill J Biesty) [email protected] (David Elliston) [email protected] (Petrus Hardianto) [email protected] (Frank Hadsell) [email protected] [email protected] (Davis W. Frank) [email protected] (Luis Giron) [email protected] (Lee Bennett) [email protected] (Gunnar Gudnason) [email protected] (Guy A. Schiavone) harvard!ames!amdcad!netcom.com!nagar ( Nagar) harvard!ames!shakespeare.ras.amdahl.com!lynn (Lynn Robinson) harvard!ames!zorch.SF-Bay.ORG!xanthian (Kent Paul Dolan) [email protected] (Denbigh Starkey) [email protected] (Ivan Maldonado) [email protected] [email protected] (John Dengler) [email protected] (Jin Kim) [email protected] kEvin [email protected] (Rob Knauerhase) [email protected] (K. Savige) [email protected] (Leo Charles Kempel) [email protected] [email protected] (Ward, Robert A) [email protected] (Audrey C Mack) [email protected] (Mark Rennebaum) [email protected] (M. P. Gerlek) [email protected] (Owen) [email protected] (Moira Mallison) [email protected] (Craig Groeschel) [email protected] (Robert F Solon) [email protected] (Norwitz Neal) [email protected] (Olaf von Bremen) [email protected] (Oktay S. Ahiska) [email protected] (Na Choon Piaw) [email protected] (Michal Prussak) [email protected] [email protected] (Mahesh Amarlal Rajani) [email protected] (Raymond Yee) richard wyckoff [email protected] (Michael Sean Rooney) [email protected] (Rudi Halbright) rutgers!mtxinu.com!jrb (John Black) rutgers!ncratl.atlantaga.ncr.com!alewis [email protected] [email protected] (Bob Schrag) [email protected] [email protected] (Meta Sienkiewicz) [email protected] (Richard Sikorski, MAC RSMAS Umiami 305-361-4714) [email protected] (Sonia Thompson) [email protected] (Chris Spell) [email protected] (Ken Staggers) [email protected] (Steinn Sigurdsson) [email protected] [email protected] (Bill Mackiewicz) [email protected] (Dennis P Hilgenberg) [email protected] (Timothy W. Lynch) [email protected] (Thomas Skibo) [email protected] (Tom Frauenhofer) [email protected] (Tellier Philippe) [email protected] (Uhhyung Choi) [email protected] (Upasana) [email protected] (David Wald) [email protected] (Carol Wang) [email protected] [email protected] (Ajay Khanna) [email protected] (Chris * 249-4092 22-Apr-1991 2216) [email protected] (Brian Yamauchi) [email protected] (yoshio nakamura) [email protected] (Zoran Kacic-Alesic) NO votes: Conor O'Neill Harald Nordg}rd-Hansen Mark M Mehl Michael M. Marx / Jerusalem - Israel. Richard H. Miller [email protected] (Carl Rigney) [email protected] (Paulo da Costa 42147) [email protected] (David Robinson) [email protected] (Tom Fitzgerald) [email protected] harvard!ames!juts.ccc.amdahl.com!ked01 (Kim DeVaughn) harvard!genrad.com!rob (Robert S. Wood) harvard!scubed!ncrons.StPaul.NCR.COM!pasek [email protected] (Jim Adamopoulos) [email protected] (Brian Kenney) [email protected] (Mark Sicignano) [email protected] (Mike Palmer) [email protected] (Leonard Peirce) [email protected] [email protected] (Rudolf Kuenzli) rutgers!cs.washington.edu!6sceng!blm (Brian Matthews) [email protected] (Dave V. Schaller) -- Brian Yamauchi University of Rochester [email protected] Department of Computer Science
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