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Metallurgy ( sci.engr.metallurgy )

From [email protected] Mon Apr 22 17:01:14 1996 Path: uunet!bounce-back From: Harris Lowenhaupt <[email protected]> Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups,news.groups,sci.engr.metallurgy,sci.engr.chem,sci.chem Subject: RFD: sci.engr.metallurgy reorganization Followup-To: news.groups Date: 22 Apr 1996 21:01:05 -0000 Organization: . Lines: 141 Sender: [email protected] Approved: [email protected] Message-ID: <[email protected]> NNTP-Posting-Host: rodan.uu.net Archive-Name: sci.engr.metallurgy-reorg Xref: uunet news.announce.newgroups:8593 news.groups:203222 sci.engr.metallurgy:6401 sci.engr.chem:15041 sci.chem:66790                       REQUEST FOR DISCUSSION (RFD)            unmoderated group sci.engr.metallurgy.extractive unmoderated group sci.engr.metallurgy.physical (renames sci.engr.metallurgy)  Newsgroup lines: sci.engr.metallurgy.extractive	Extractive metallurgy; mining, geology. sci.engr.metallurgy.physical	Physical metallurgy; alloys, metal surface.  This is a formal Request For Discussion (RFD) for the reorganization of the metallurgy groups in the sci.engr.* hierarchy.  This is not a Call for Votes (CFV); you cannot vote at this time.  Procedural details are below.  RATIONALE: all groups  The field of metallurgy is profoundly divided into two groups which are, except for their mutual interest in metals, almost unrelated technically.  A newsgroup already exists (sci.engr.metallurgy) which is utilized, apparently exclusively, by physical metallurgists. Physical metallurgy deals with the use of metals in materials, such as alloys, special surfaces, and the like.  It is essentially a materials science practiced in a wide variety of industries and public agencies.  On the other fork of the metallurgy dichotomy are the extractive metallurgists.  These are the people who practice recovery and refining of the metals (and of nonmetallic minerals) from their ores and from waste streams.  Extractive metallurgists can be viewed as producers of the raw materials used by physical metallurgists.  Their discipline is essentially chemical engineering applied to metals, and is a branch of the mining industry.  Because of the wide gulf in the type of science and technology used by the two separate wings of the metallurgical profession, the subjects are seldom treated in the same forum.  Since there is no newsgroup at present directed to serving extractive metallurgists, they are not able to avail themselves of the advantages of the Usenet, and other users in search of extractive metallurgical information or advice have no place to directly contact the exact people they are seeking.  This deficiency is noted in postings seeking extractive metallurgical information in various groups in the sci.* hierarchy which do not normally deal with mining technology.  The new group proposed here will alleviate this shortcoming for both practicing extractive metallurgists and for usenet users from other disciplines in need of special knowledge in the field.  Other users will include, but not be limited to, practitioners of mining engineering, geology and environmental sciences.  Extractive metallurgists will have a newsgroup available for their own special technology and interaction.  The exchange of information will at last extend the great value of Usenet to this profession which heretofore has done without or relied on what are essentially off-topic postings to other sci groups.  Physical metallurgists will continue their utilization of the Usenet without change or interruption, and will be able to avail themselves of the companion newsgroup when they need interaction with their extractive counterparts.  Non-metallurgists seeking extractive metallurgical information will have a forum in which to direct inquiries and to learn from postings by experts.  Physical metallurgists will avoid having to sort through extensive extractive postings in the group which is their special province.  Information exchange between extractive and physical metallurgical practitioners will be facilitated in both directions without disruption of either group.  CHARTER: sci.engr.metallurgy.extractive  The purpose of sci.engr.metallurgy.extractive is to provide an open discussion forum for extractive metallurgists on the Internet.  The newsgroups allow the rapid and timely discussion of opinions and information that would take months or years (or not at all) on conventional paper journals.  Topics for discussion would include:  Mineral processing: comminution, new flotation reagents, flowsheet ideas, experimental methods etc.  Pyrometallurgy: high temperature thermodynamics, kinetics, refractories, experimental techniques (furnace building) etc.  Hydrometallurgy: aqueous thermodynamics, kinetics, leaching, new and old processes, solvent extraction, electrometallurgy, experimental techniques etc.  General: announcements, reviews of papers, conferences, general discussion, opinions, questions etc.  END CHARTER.  CHARTER: sci.engr.metallurgy.physical  The purpose of sci.engr.metallurgy.physical is to provide an open discussion forum for physical metallurgists on the Internet.  The newsgroups allow the rapid and timely discussion of opinions and information that would take months or years (or not at all) on conventional paper journals.  Topics for discussion would include:  Physical Metallurgy: microstructure of steels and other non-ferrous metals, etchants, microscopy (optical, electron, SEM), XRD etc  Mechanical Metallurgy: mechanical properties, rolling, forging and extrusion, brazing and welding, etc.  General: announcements, reviews of papers, conferences, general discussion, opinions, questions etc.  END CHARTER.  PROCEDURE:  This is a request for discussion, not a call for votes.  In this phase of the process, any potential problems with the proposed newsgroups should be raised and resolved.  The discussion period will continue for a minimum of 21 days (starting from when the first RFD for this proposal is posted to news.announce.newgroups), after which a Call For Votes (CFV) may be posted by a neutral vote taker if the discussion warrants it.  Please do not attempt to vote until this happens.  All discussion of this proposal should be posted to news.groups.  This RFD attempts to comply fully with the Usenet newsgroup creation guidelines outlined in "How to Create a New Usenet Newsgroup" and "How to Format and Submit a New Group Proposal".  Please refer to these documents (available in news.announce.newgroups) if you have any questions about the process.  DISTRIBUTION:  This RFD has been posted to the following newsgroups:  news.announce.newgroups, news.groups sci.engr.metallurgy, sci.engr.chem sci.chem  Proponent: Harris Lowenhaupt <[email protected]> Mentor: Jonathan Grobe <[email protected]>  From [email protected] Thu May 30 18:39:44 1996 Path: uunet!bounce-back From: [email protected] (David Bostwick) Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups,news.groups,sci.engr.metallurgy,sci.engr.chem,sci.chem Subject: CFV: sci.engr.metallurgy reorganization Followup-To: poster Date: 30 May 1996 22:39:53 -0000 Organization: Usenet Volunteer Votetakers (UVV) Lines: 185 Sender: [email protected] Approved: [email protected] Expires: 21 Jun 1996 00:00:00 GMT Message-ID: <[email protected]> NNTP-Posting-Host: rodan.uu.net Archive-Name: sci.engr.metallurgy-reorg Xref: uunet news.announce.newgroups:8763 news.groups:208722 sci.engr.metallurgy:7076 sci.engr.chem:16034 sci.chem:69753                       FIRST CALL FOR VOTES (of 2)            unmoderated group sci.engr.metallurgy.extractive unmoderated group sci.engr.metallurgy.physical (renames sci.engr.metallurgy)  Newsgroup lines: sci.engr.metallurgy.extractive	Extractive metallurgy; mining, geology. sci.engr.metallurgy.physical	Physical metallurgy; alloys, metal surface.  Votes must be received by 23:59:59 UTC, 20 Jun 1996.  This vote is being conducted by a neutral third party.  Questions about the voting process should be directed to the votetaker.  Questions about the proposed group should be directed to the proponent.  Proponent:  Harris Lowenhaupt <[email protected]> Mentor:     Jonathan Grobe <[email protected]> Votetaker:  David Bostwick <[email protected]>  RATIONALE: all groups  The field of metallurgy is profoundly divided into two groups which are, except for their mutual interest in metals, almost unrelated technically.  A newsgroup already exists (sci.engr.metallurgy) which is utilized, apparently exclusively, by physical metallurgists. Physical metallurgy deals with the use of metals in materials, such as alloys, special surfaces, and the like.  It is essentially a materials science practiced in a wide variety of industries and public agencies.  On the other fork of the metallurgy dichotomy are the extractive metallurgists.  These are the people who practice recovery and refining of the metals (and of nonmetallic minerals) from their ores and from waste streams.  Extractive metallurgists can be viewed as producers of the raw materials used by physical metallurgists.  Their discipline is essentially chemical engineering applied to metals, and is a branch of the mining industry.  Because of the wide gulf in the type of science and technology used by the two separate wings of the metallurgical profession, the subjects are seldom treated in the same forum.  Since there is no newsgroup at present directed to serving extractive metallurgists, they are not able to avail themselves of the advantages of the Usenet, and other users in search of extractive metallurgical information or advice have no place to directly contact the exact people they are seeking.  This deficiency is noted in postings seeking extractive metallurgical information in various groups in the sci.* hierarchy which do not normally deal with mining technology.  The new group proposed here will alleviate this shortcoming for both practicing extractive metallurgists and for usenet users from other disciplines in need of special knowledge in the field.  Other users will include, but not be limited to, practitioners of mining engineering, geology and environmental sciences.  Extractive metallurgists will have a newsgroup available for their own special technology and interaction.  The exchange of information will at last extend the great value of Usenet to this profession which heretofore has done without or relied on what are essentially off-topic postings to other sci groups.  Physical metallurgists will continue their utilization of the Usenet without change or interruption, and will be able to avail themselves of the companion newsgroup when they need interaction with their extractive counterparts.  Non-metallurgists seeking extractive metallurgical information will have a forum in which to direct inquiries and to learn from postings by experts.  Physical metallurgists will avoid having to sort through extensive extractive postings in the group which is their special province.  Information exchange between extractive and physical metallurgical practitioners will be facilitated in both directions without disruption of either group.  CHARTER: sci.engr.metallurgy.extractive  The purpose of sci.engr.metallurgy.extractive is to provide an open discussion forum for extractive metallurgists on the Internet.  The newsgroups allow the rapid and timely discussion of opinions and information that would take months or years (or not at all) on conventional paper journals.  Topics for discussion would include:  Mineral processing: comminution, new flotation reagents, flowsheet ideas, experimental methods etc.  Pyrometallurgy: high temperature thermodynamics, kinetics, refractories, experimental techniques (furnace building) etc.  Hydrometallurgy: aqueous thermodynamics, kinetics, leaching, new and old processes, solvent extraction, electrometallurgy, experimental techniques etc.  General: announcements, reviews of papers, conferences, general discussion, opinions, questions etc.  END CHARTER.  CHARTER: sci.engr.metallurgy.physical  The purpose of sci.engr.metallurgy.physical is to provide an open discussion forum for physical metallurgists on the Internet.  The newsgroups allow the rapid and timely discussion of opinions and information that would take months or years (or not at all) on conventional paper journals.  Topics for discussion would include:  Physical Metallurgy: microstructure of steels and other non-ferrous metals, etchants, microscopy (optical, electron, SEM), XRD etc  Mechanical Metallurgy: mechanical properties, rolling, forging and extrusion, brazing and welding, etc.  General: announcements, reviews of papers, conferences, general discussion, opinions, questions etc.  END CHARTER.  DISTRIBUTION:  This CFV has been posted to the following newsgroups:  news.announce.newgroups, news.groups sci.engr.metallurgy, sci.engr.chem sci.chem  HOW TO VOTE  Delete everything above the top "-=-=-" line and delete everything below the bottom -=-=-" line.  Do not change anything between these lines, except to add your name and vote.  Give your name on the line that asks for it.  For each group, put your vote in the brackets next to the group name.  Valid entries are ABSTAIN, CANCEL, NO, and YES.  Anything else may generate an invalid vote.  Don't worry about changes in spacing or any quote characters (">") that your reply may insert.  Mail the ballot to <[email protected]>.  Just replying to this should work, but check the "To:" line.  Votes must be mailed directly from the voter to the votetaker.  Distributing pre-marked or otherwise edited ballots is considered vote fraud.  Only one vote is allowed per person or per account.  Votes will be acknowleged by e-mail.  If you have not received an acknowledgement within a few days, contact the votetaker.  It is your responsibility to be certain your vote has been recorded correctly.  If you want to change your vote, you may vote again, but only the latest vote will be counted. Addresses and votes of all voters will be published in the final vote ack.  The purpose of a Usenet vote is to determine the genuine interest of people who would read a proposed newsgroup.  Soliciting votes from disinterested parties defeats this purpose.  Please do not distribute this CFV.  If you must, direct people to the official CFV as posted in news.groups.  When in doubt, ask the votetaker.  -=-=- BEGINNING OF BALLOT: DELETE EVERYTHING ABOVE THIS LINE =-=-=-=-=-=-= This ballot is available only from postings  |   FIRST CALL FOR VOTES    | in news.groups or by e-mail from the         | SCI.ENGR.METALLURGY REORG | votetaker.  It is distributed blank.  Votes  |                 | are counted by computer, and failure to use  ============================= this ballot increases the possibility that the software will be unable to process your vote properly.  Do not edit this ballot except to add your name and indicate your vote.  These are examples of how to mark the ballot.  Do not vote here. [   YES   ] example.yes.vote [   NO    ] example.no.vote [ ABSTAIN ] example.abstain.vote [ CANCEL  ] example.cancel.vote  The placement of the word within the brackets is not important, but use the complete word, not just one letter.  Enter your name and indicate your vote in the spaces below. ------------------------------------------------------------------------  Give your real name here: If you do not give your real name, your vote may be rejected.  [Your Vote]  Group (Place your vote below in the brackets next to the group) ------------------------------------------------------------------------- [         ]  sci.engr.metallurgy.extractive [         ]  sci.engr.metallurgy.physical -=-=-=-=  END OF BALLOT: DELETE EVERYTHING BELOW THIS LINE  =-=-=-=-=-=-=  From [email protected] Mon Jun 10 14:30:32 1996 Path: uunet!bounce-back From: [email protected] (David Bostwick) Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups,news.groups,sci.engr.metallurgy,sci.engr.chem,sci.chem Subject: 2nd CFV: sci.engr.metallurgy reorganization Supersedes: <[email protected]> Followup-To: poster Date: 10 Jun 1996 18:30:58 -0000 Organization: Usenet Volunteer Votetakers (UVV) Lines: 185 Sender: [email protected] Approved: [email protected] Expires: 21 Jun 1996 00:00:00 GMT Message-ID: <[email protected]> References: <[email protected]> NNTP-Posting-Host: rodan.uu.net Archive-Name: sci.engr.metallurgy-reorg Xref: uunet news.announce.newgroups:8810 news.groups:211031 sci.engr.metallurgy:7274 sci.engr.chem:16234 sci.chem:70622                        LAST CALL FOR VOTES (of 2)            unmoderated group sci.engr.metallurgy.extractive unmoderated group sci.engr.metallurgy.physical (renames sci.engr.metallurgy)  Newsgroup lines: sci.engr.metallurgy.extractive	Extractive metallurgy; mining, geology. sci.engr.metallurgy.physical	Physical metallurgy; alloys, metal surface.  Votes must be received by 23:59:59 UTC, 20 Jun 1996.  This vote is being conducted by a neutral third party.  Questions about the voting process should be directed to the votetaker.  Questions about the proposed group should be directed to the proponent.  Proponent:  Harris Lowenhaupt <[email protected]> Mentor:     Jonathan Grobe <[email protected]> Votetaker:  David Bostwick <[email protected]>  RATIONALE: all groups  The field of metallurgy is profoundly divided into two groups which are, except for their mutual interest in metals, almost unrelated technically.  A newsgroup already exists (sci.engr.metallurgy) which is utilized, apparently exclusively, by physical metallurgists. Physical metallurgy deals with the use of metals in materials, such as alloys, special surfaces, and the like.  It is essentially a materials science practiced in a wide variety of industries and public agencies.  On the other fork of the metallurgy dichotomy are the extractive metallurgists.  These are the people who practice recovery and refining of the metals (and of nonmetallic minerals) from their ores and from waste streams.  Extractive metallurgists can be viewed as producers of the raw materials used by physical metallurgists.  Their discipline is essentially chemical engineering applied to metals, and is a branch of the mining industry.  Because of the wide gulf in the type of science and technology used by the two separate wings of the metallurgical profession, the subjects are seldom treated in the same forum.  Since there is no newsgroup at present directed to serving extractive metallurgists, they are not able to avail themselves of the advantages of the Usenet, and other users in search of extractive metallurgical information or advice have no place to directly contact the exact people they are seeking.  This deficiency is noted in postings seeking extractive metallurgical information in various groups in the sci.* hierarchy which do not normally deal with mining technology.  The new group proposed here will alleviate this shortcoming for both practicing extractive metallurgists and for usenet users from other disciplines in need of special knowledge in the field.  Other users will include, but not be limited to, practitioners of mining engineering, geology and environmental sciences.  Extractive metallurgists will have a newsgroup available for their own special technology and interaction.  The exchange of information will at last extend the great value of Usenet to this profession which heretofore has done without or relied on what are essentially off-topic postings to other sci groups.  Physical metallurgists will continue their utilization of the Usenet without change or interruption, and will be able to avail themselves of the companion newsgroup when they need interaction with their extractive counterparts.  Non-metallurgists seeking extractive metallurgical information will have a forum in which to direct inquiries and to learn from postings by experts.  Physical metallurgists will avoid having to sort through extensive extractive postings in the group which is their special province.  Information exchange between extractive and physical metallurgical practitioners will be facilitated in both directions without disruption of either group.  CHARTER: sci.engr.metallurgy.extractive  The purpose of sci.engr.metallurgy.extractive is to provide an open discussion forum for extractive metallurgists on the Internet.  The newsgroups allow the rapid and timely discussion of opinions and information that would take months or years (or not at all) on conventional paper journals.  Topics for discussion would include:  Mineral processing: comminution, new flotation reagents, flowsheet ideas, experimental methods etc.  Pyrometallurgy: high temperature thermodynamics, kinetics, refractories, experimental techniques (furnace building) etc.  Hydrometallurgy: aqueous thermodynamics, kinetics, leaching, new and old processes, solvent extraction, electrometallurgy, experimental techniques etc.  General: announcements, reviews of papers, conferences, general discussion, opinions, questions etc.  END CHARTER.  CHARTER: sci.engr.metallurgy.physical  The purpose of sci.engr.metallurgy.physical is to provide an open discussion forum for physical metallurgists on the Internet.  The newsgroups allow the rapid and timely discussion of opinions and information that would take months or years (or not at all) on conventional paper journals.  Topics for discussion would include:  Physical Metallurgy: microstructure of steels and other non-ferrous metals, etchants, microscopy (optical, electron, SEM), XRD etc  Mechanical Metallurgy: mechanical properties, rolling, forging and extrusion, brazing and welding, etc.  General: announcements, reviews of papers, conferences, general discussion, opinions, questions etc.  END CHARTER.  DISTRIBUTION:  This CFV has been posted to the following newsgroups:  news.announce.newgroups, news.groups sci.engr.metallurgy, sci.engr.chem sci.chem  HOW TO VOTE  Delete everything above the top "-=-=-" line and delete everything below the bottom -=-=-" line.  Do not change anything between these lines, except to add your name and vote.  Give your name on the line that asks for it.  For each group, put your vote in the brackets next to the group name.  Valid entries are ABSTAIN, CANCEL, NO, and YES.  Anything else may generate an invalid vote.  Don't worry about changes in spacing or any quote characters (">") that your reply may insert.  Mail the ballot to <[email protected]>.  Just replying to this should work, but check the "To:" line.  Votes must be mailed directly from the voter to the votetaker.  Distributing pre-marked or otherwise edited ballots is considered vote fraud.  Only one vote is allowed per person or per account.  Votes will be acknowleged by e-mail.  If you have not received an acknowledgement within a few days, contact the votetaker.  It is your responsibility to be certain your vote has been recorded correctly.  If you want to change your vote, you may vote again, but only the latest vote will be counted. Addresses and votes of all voters will be published in the final vote ack.  The purpose of a Usenet vote is to determine the genuine interest of people who would read a proposed newsgroup.  Soliciting votes from disinterested parties defeats this purpose.  Please do not distribute this CFV.  If you must, direct people to the official CFV as posted in news.groups.  When in doubt, ask the votetaker.  -=-=- BEGINNING OF BALLOT: DELETE EVERYTHING ABOVE THIS LINE =-=-=-=-=-=-= This ballot is available only from postings  |    LAST CALL FOR VOTES    | in news.groups or by e-mail from the         | SCI.ENGR.METALLURGY REORG | votetaker.  It is distributed blank.  Votes  |                 | are counted by computer, and failure to use  ============================= this ballot increases the possibility that the software will be unable to process your vote properly.  Do not edit this ballot except to add your name and indicate your vote.  These are examples of how to mark the ballot.  Do not vote here. [   YES   ] example.yes.vote [   NO    ] example.no.vote [ ABSTAIN ] example.abstain.vote [ CANCEL  ] example.cancel.vote  The placement of the word within the brackets is not important, but use the complete word, not just one letter.  Enter your name and indicate your vote in the spaces below. ------------------------------------------------------------------------  Give your real name here: If you do not give your real name, your vote may be rejected.  [Your Vote]  Group (Place your vote below in the brackets next to the group) ------------------------------------------------------------------------- [         ]  sci.engr.metallurgy.extractive [         ]  sci.engr.metallurgy.physical -=-=-=-=  END OF BALLOT: DELETE EVERYTHING BELOW THIS LINE  =-=-=-=-=-=-=  From [email protected] Thu Jun 20 22:00:04 1996 Path: uunet!bounce-back From: [email protected] (David Bostwick) Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups,news.groups,sci.engr.metallurgy,sci.engr.chem,sci.chem Subject: RESULT: sci.engr.metallurgy reorganization - all groups fail Supersedes: <[email protected]> Followup-To: news.groups Date: 20 Jun 1996 22:00:37 -0400 Organization: Usenet Volunteer Votetakers (UVV) Lines: 211 Sender: [email protected] Approved: [email protected] Message-ID: <[email protected]> References: <[email protected]> <[email protected]> NNTP-Posting-Host: rodan.uu.net Archive-Name: sci.engr.metallurgy-reorg Xref: uunet news.announce.newgroups:8877 news.groups:212892 sci.engr.metallurgy:7462 sci.engr.chem:16403 sci.chem:71300                                  RESULT      unmoderated group sci.engr.metallurgy.extractive fails 57:15       unmoderated group sci.engr.metallurgy.physical fails 52:18  sci.engr.metallurgy reorganization results - 76 valid votes   Yes   No : 2/3? >100? : Pass? : Group ---- ---- : ---- ----- : ----- : -------------------------------------------   57   15 :  Yes    No :    No : sci.engr.metallurgy.extractive   52   18 :  Yes    No :    No : sci.engr.metallurgy.physical (renames sci.engr.metallurgy)  A five-day waiting period follows this vote.  Unless serious allegations of voting irregularities arise, the group may not be voted on again for six months.  Newsgroup lines: sci.engr.metallurgy.extractive	Extractive metallurgy; mining, geology. sci.engr.metallurgy.physical	Physical metallurgy; alloys, metal surface.  The voting period ended at 23:59:59 UTC, 20 Jun 1996.  This vote was conducted by a neutral third party.  Questions about the voting process should be directed to the votetaker.  Questions about the proposed group should be directed to the proponent.  Proponent:  Harris Lowenhaupt <[email protected]> Mentor:     Jonathan Grobe <[email protected]> Votetaker:  David Bostwick <[email protected]>  RATIONALE: all groups  The field of metallurgy is profoundly divided into two groups which are, except for their mutual interest in metals, almost unrelated technically.  A newsgroup already exists (sci.engr.metallurgy) which is utilized, apparently exclusively, by physical metallurgists. Physical metallurgy deals with the use of metals in materials, such as alloys, special surfaces, and the like.  It is essentially a materials science practiced in a wide variety of industries and public agencies.  On the other fork of the metallurgy dichotomy are the extractive metallurgists.  These are the people who practice recovery and refining of the metals (and of nonmetallic minerals) from their ores and from waste streams.  Extractive metallurgists can be viewed as producers of the raw materials used by physical metallurgists.  Their discipline is essentially chemical engineering applied to metals, and is a branch of the mining industry.  Because of the wide gulf in the type of science and technology used by the two separate wings of the metallurgical profession, the subjects are seldom treated in the same forum.  Since there is no newsgroup at present directed to serving extractive metallurgists, they are not able to avail themselves of the advantages of the Usenet, and other users in search of extractive metallurgical information or advice have no place to directly contact the exact people they are seeking.  This deficiency is noted in postings seeking extractive metallurgical information in various groups in the sci.* hierarchy which do not normally deal with mining technology.  The new group proposed here will alleviate this shortcoming for both practicing extractive metallurgists and for usenet users from other disciplines in need of special knowledge in the field.  Other users will include, but not be limited to, practitioners of mining engineering, geology and environmental sciences.  Extractive metallurgists will have a newsgroup available for their own special technology and interaction.  The exchange of information will at last extend the great value of Usenet to this profession which heretofore has done without or relied on what are essentially off-topic postings to other sci groups.  Physical metallurgists will continue their utilization of the Usenet without change or interruption, and will be able to avail themselves of the companion newsgroup when they need interaction with their extractive counterparts.  Non-metallurgists seeking extractive metallurgical information will have a forum in which to direct inquiries and to learn from postings by experts.  Physical metallurgists will avoid having to sort through extensive extractive postings in the group which is their special province.  Information exchange between extractive and physical metallurgical practitioners will be facilitated in both directions without disruption of either group.  CHARTER: sci.engr.metallurgy.extractive  The purpose of sci.engr.metallurgy.extractive is to provide an open discussion forum for extractive metallurgists on the Internet.  The newsgroups allow the rapid and timely discussion of opinions and information that would take months or years (or not at all) on conventional paper journals.  Topics for discussion would include:  Mineral processing: comminution, new flotation reagents, flowsheet ideas, experimental methods etc.  Pyrometallurgy: high temperature thermodynamics, kinetics, refractories, experimental techniques (furnace building) etc.  Hydrometallurgy: aqueous thermodynamics, kinetics, leaching, new and old processes, solvent extraction, electrometallurgy, experimental techniques etc.  General: announcements, reviews of papers, conferences, general discussion, opinions, questions etc.  END CHARTER.  CHARTER: sci.engr.metallurgy.physical  The purpose of sci.engr.metallurgy.physical is to provide an open discussion forum for physical metallurgists on the Internet.  The newsgroups allow the rapid and timely discussion of opinions and information that would take months or years (or not at all) on conventional paper journals.  Topics for discussion would include:  Physical Metallurgy: microstructure of steels and other non-ferrous metals, etchants, microscopy (optical, electron, SEM), XRD etc  Mechanical Metallurgy: mechanical properties, rolling, forging and extrusion, brazing and welding, etc.  General: announcements, reviews of papers, conferences, general discussion, opinions, questions etc.  END CHARTER.  sci.engr.metallurgy reorganization Final Vote Ack                 sci.engr.metallurgy.physical (renames sci.engr.metallurgy) ----+                                           sci.engr.metallurgy.extractive ---+|                                                                             || [email protected]                          Charles W. (Rick) Kenney YY [email protected]                                    Andrew Payzant NN [email protected]                                            Thomas Adler NN [email protected]                                          Antony Cowey YY [email protected]                                    Dmitry A.Andryushechkin YN [email protected]                                     Nick Andryushechkin YN [email protected]                                 Al Rosenfield YY [email protected]                                               Antti S. Korhonen NN [email protected]                                          Martin H. Booda NN [email protected]                                        Charles Carson YY [email protected]                                          Alan Walker YY [email protected]                                                 Kelvin Chow -Y [email protected]                                      Cameron John Davidson YY [email protected]                                            Chris Stamper YY [email protected]                                              Minister of Truth YY [email protected]                                               David Drake N- [email protected]                                        Valentin Bystrov YN [email protected]                                                      Ryan YY [email protected]                                             JAMES EDLER,  YY [email protected]                                                    evergold YY [email protected]                                               Fred B. Fletcher NN [email protected]                                          Chris Shaw YY [email protected]                                                 Jim Harkins YY [email protected]                             James T. (Jim) Furey, P.Eng YY [email protected]                                  Susan Nagy YY [email protected]                                          Jud Ready YY [email protected]                                    Harry Mueller YY [email protected]                             Christian Hofer YY [email protected]                                      Ian Scott Blair YY [email protected]                                       Ian Mitchell Y- [email protected]                                         Ian Murphy YY [email protected]                                   Jeffrey J. Weimer YY [email protected]                        Joseph Cornellisson YY [email protected]                                      Kenneth D. Wade YY [email protected]                                           Kim DeVaughn YY [email protected]    [email protected] -Y [email protected]                                     Lachlan Cranswick YY [email protected]                                        Lars Dannenberg YY [email protected]                                              Leonard Migliore YY [email protected]                                           David McCamey YY [email protected]                                              Alan Morton YY [email protected]                                                      Mark Brader NY [email protected]                       Nick Fosteras Y- [email protected]                                  Harris Lowenhaupt YY [email protected]                                                 Tom Doggart YY [email protected]                                      Oleg Ostrovski Y- [email protected]                                           Oguocha Ike YY [email protected]                                          Olav Nieuwejaar NN [email protected]                                      Ollivier Robert YY [email protected]                                            david parsons YN [email protected]                                        Patrick J. LoPresti NN [email protected]                                           Paul Passarelli  YY [email protected]                                           Trevor Tymchuk YY [email protected]                                    Peter Fagan Y- [email protected]                                  Alexandru Platon -jr. YY [email protected]                                       Petri J Savolainen NN [email protected]                                         Ralf W. Stephan YY [email protected]                                            Randy C. Davis NN [email protected]                                             Richard Miller NN [email protected]                                              Rod J. Smith YY [email protected]                                          Rodney Jones YY [email protected]                                      S. Bhattacharyya YY [email protected]                                   Simon Mitchell YY [email protected]                                        John Slampyak -Y [email protected]                                         Mike Sorokin YN [email protected]                                           Stewart Park YY [email protected]                                               Dwight Brown NN [email protected]                                       Hamish Mackie YY [email protected]                                    Ted Smith YY [email protected]                                            Tom Griffin YY [email protected]                                          Todd Steiger YY [email protected]                                               N.T. Wakelyn -N [email protected]                                      Risto Widenius NN [email protected]                           Norman A. Woodward NY [email protected]                                   H. Wayne Richardson Y- [email protected]                                 Wright, Bryan BD YY